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Messages - Dan

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I own a Vanguard SUM MOA Varmint in .22-250.  I think it's an awesome caliber for coyote, p-dog, and just shooting at the range.  You can get ammo for it just about anywhere and it doesn't cost and arm and a leg.

I know a lot of guys who coyote hunt with .308 and .223.  I think they both have there advantages.  You can get a little more range and nock down with the .308 and the .223 is cheap and you have lots of choices.

I shot in a 300 and 600 meter bench rest competition recently with my .22-250.  There was a 17-20 mph cross wind and my 45 grain bullet was holding as tight of groups as all the other .308 and 7mm shooters.

I've never had trouble with taking down coyotes with .22-250.  It carries enough punch to put them down out to 500 yards.  If you're not a very good caller (like myself), you’ll probably be taking some longer shots than those guy who can bring them in to short range.  If you are shooting coyote inside 75 yards you probably don't need a .22-250 or .308.

If you're looking for an all purpose caliber, I would recommend something bigger than the .22s.  .243 or .257 fit the bill pretty good.

Good luck.

Around the Campfire (General Discussion) / Re: Joke of the day.
« on: January 23, 2008, 10:59:23 PM »
A young gun fighter, hoping to become the fastest gun in the West, enters a saloon and sits down next to an old man formally known for being the fastest gun fighter around.  The young gun fighter asks the old man if he had any tip that could help him out.

The old man said sure and asked to see the young man's stance.

The young gun fighter, eager to learn, stood up to drawl his pistol and the old man stopped him.  He said, 'Your holster is way too high.  Move it down on your hip more.'

The young gun fighter pushed his holster down and drew his gun and shot the bow tie off the piano player playing piano in the corner.

The young man so impressed asked the old man for another tip.

The old man said, 'Cut a notch in your holster for the hammer and that should help a little.'

The young gun did just that and drew his pistol even faster this time and shot the cufflinks off the piano player in the corner.

The young man was once again impressed and asked if the old man had one last tip.

The old man replied, 'See that axle grease in that can over there.  Rub it all over your gun.'

The young man, a little skeptical, did as he was instructed and then ask, 'Why the axle grease?  Will that help me drawl my gun even faster?'

The old man answered, 'No.  But where Wyatt Earp gets done playing piano, it won't hurt so bad when he comes over here and shoves that gun up your A$$.'

Around the Campfire (General Discussion) / Joke of the day.
« on: January 22, 2008, 04:14:42 PM »
Hillary Clinton, the lead Presidential Democratic Party candidate, tends to get on her soap box about banning all guns in America. She is considered to be more than just a little self-righteous. 

Last week at a rural elementary school meeting in north Texas she asked the audience of kids for total silence. Then she started to slowly clap her hands, once every few seconds. Holding the audience in total silence, she said into the microphone, “Every time I clap my hands, a child in America dies from gun violence.”

A young boy in the front row named Johnny stood up and shouted out, "Well, stop clappin, your hands you stupid b**ch!"

Keep 'em coming.

I would have to say my Marlin .22 my old man bought me when I was 13.  That trusty rifle has seen some tough days hunting squirrel and rabbit, but it still shoots great.  I've had the stock replaced on it and it looks great as will.


Rifles / Re: Barrel Contour Question - Need Advice
« on: January 16, 2008, 07:43:52 PM »
I would say you should look at how you are going to use the rifle to determine if you want the heavy barrel or not.  Spending time at the range or setting for hours shooting p-dogs is a lot different than walking long distances while hunting yotes.  That heavy barrel might not seem like such a good idea on about stand four on a 95 degree day.

However, as far as accuracy, they should both shoot the same.  You can just shoot more times in a row and keep your groups more consistent with a heavy barrel.  It doesn't heat up quite as quickly.  On a 35 degree day I can sit at the range and shoot a string of ten in a row before the barrel warms up and the groups start to open up.  Let is cool back down for a few minutes and you're back in business.

I have a SUB-MOA Varmint in 22-250 so I would expect you would have a similar experience with it in .223.  I think the rifle is great for what I shoot and how I hunt, but I don't carry it around for miles all day long either.

Hope this helps.  Dan

Rifles / Re: Discuss the Weatherby Vanguard® SUB-MOA Varmint
« on: January 13, 2008, 08:13:05 AM »
I think you will be very happy with the SUB-MOA Varmint.  I've put a couple hundred rounds through mine so far and am still searching for the best factory ammunition.  Winchester 45 gr. JHP seems to shoot the best.  I've posted a few pictures in my trophy room.  I did replace the trigger with a Timney and couldn't be happier with it.  I have never seen one in stainless though.  Hope you enjoy your new rifle.


B-1B Pilot.  Picture of me over Afghanistan a couple of months ago.  Taken by a boom operator of a KC-135.


Rifles / Re: 22-250 in Vanguard?
« on: January 03, 2008, 09:24:12 AM »
I too have suffered from that same itch and have scratched it twice.  Several years ago I purchased my first .22-250.  It was a Ruger M77 Target.  I loved that rifle, but at the time thought I needed something different.  I sold it and purchased a different rifle, different caliber.  (Worst decision ever)

I love to coyote and prairie dog hunt and spend time at the range.  I love .22-250 because it is a great round for doing all three.

I recently purchased a Vanguard SUM MOA Varmint .22-250.  I like this rifle as much as I did my Ruger.  I put a Leupold Mark 4 6.5-20X50 on top.  The only modification I did to the rifle was put a Timney trigger in it.  That gave me a lighter trigger pull and it breaks like glass.

I don't hand load...yet, but I've shot about every kind of factory ammo I can get my hands on.  It depends on what part of the country you're from on how popular .22-250 is off the shelf.  In Texas I can get it about everywhere and have several choices in brand, grains, and bullet type.  The cheapest Winchester in 45 gr. JHP seems to shoot the best.  I average just less than 1" groups at 100 yards with it.  I've posted a few pics under my profile.

Like any Weatherby rife, I don't think you will be disappointed in it.  As far as .22-250, I'm a little bias as it's my favorite round.

My wife even enjoys shooting my/our new Weatherby.


Around the Campfire (General Discussion) / Re: Mill dot scopes
« on: January 02, 2008, 06:08:13 PM »
There are several different ways to determine distance using a MILDOT equipped scopes.  Here is the easiest formula to determine distance using a MILDOT reticle.  [Target Size (inches) X 27.77 / MILs = Distance (yards)]  e.g.  Varmint = 9"; Looking through the scope - Varmint = 2 MILs; therefore, Varmint distance = 125 yards.

You might also see this formula.  [Target Size (yards) X 1000 / MILs = Distance (yards)]  Both formulas work the same.  I'll let you do the algebra to prove them, but I usually know the target size in inches and the first formula saves me a step.

If you have a variable power scope you must make sure you have it set on the appropriate power setting to correctly determine the MIL height of the target.  Most are set to the highest magnification, but check the owners manual or online to make sure.

There are several websites out there that can explain this all better.  www.mildot.com

With a little practice you can get very good at estimating distances quickly.  I put together a little chart for when I'm hunting prairie dogs and another for hunting yotes to save me from having to do the math.

I hope this helps.

Rifles / Re: How accurate is YOUR Weatherby?
« on: December 29, 2007, 03:27:26 PM »
Today was competition day at the range.  My Wife, sister-in-law, her boy friend and I went out for the 100 yard break an egg challenge.  I went to the store and bought some Winchester soft points for my .22-250 SUB MOA Varmint.  I shot a few rounds at a paper target to determine where it was shooting in comparison to the other loads I usually shoot.  A few rounds and a couple clicks later the "fight" was on.  I'm sad to say that my wife out shot me… and every one else, breaking more eggs than the rest of us.  She was shooting over .500 and the rest of us just under.  All-in-all it was another great day at the range with my Weatherby.  I think this is just another testament to the quality and accuracy of Weatherby, when you can just pick up a couple boxes of off the shelf ammo from Wal-Mart and even the inexperienced shooters can break eggs at 100 yards.  Good Shootin'   Dan

Around the Campfire (General Discussion) / Re: Timney Trigger for Vanguard
« on: December 29, 2007, 08:21:20 AM »
I replaced my factory trigger in my Weatherby Vanguard SUB MOA Varmint with a Timney trigger.  Yes, your factory trigger can be adjusted, but if you are looking for another option, I recommend Timney.  They are light, crisp and you can install it yourself.  All three safety positions work and I didn't have to relieve any material.  Hope this helps.  Dan

Around the Campfire (General Discussion) / Re: Where's everybody from
« on: December 23, 2007, 05:49:27 AM »
I call Kansas home, but I'm in the military and currently live in Texas.  Texas is starting to grow on my though, so I figure it's about time for me to have to move some place new.


Optics / Re: scopes for weatherby rifles
« on: December 22, 2007, 08:29:26 PM »
I love my Leupold 6.5-20x50 on my .22-250 SUB MOA Varmint.  I think it’s a crime to buy an awesome rifle and not put a worthy scope on top.  I tested several scopes from Bushnell Elite to Zeiss, as will as some scopes I've never heard of.  I love the eye relief of the Leupold as well as the quality and clarity.  A long time ago some guy told me not to waste my time and money buying a cheap scope telling myself I will up grade later.  Do it right the first time and you will never be disappointed.  You might be a little lighter in the wallet, but happier in the long run.


Rifles / Re: How accurate is YOUR Weatherby?
« on: December 18, 2007, 07:45:46 PM »
I just purchased a Vanguard SUB-MOA Varmint in .22-250.  I've put 100 rounds through it so far and I think the rifle is more accurate than I am right now.  My 100 yard groups are right at 1".  I did shoot a .71" group at 200 yards on my last string at the range.  This is with the cheapest Winchester ammo you can get.  I don't think you can find a more accurate rifle for the money.  I didn't know if I could ever replace my Ruger M77 target, but I have now done so.  I'm hoping with a little more practice and finding the right ammo I can consistently have 3/4" groups at 200 yards.  Then the prairie dogs had better be ware.


Varmint / Re: Maximum gr weight bullets Vanguard Varminter 223?
« on: December 15, 2007, 04:04:51 PM »
Here is what some might say is the "book answer."  The Greenhill formula is a formula to tell you what twist rate you need for a given bullet.  To calculate the rifling twist rate, divide 150 by the length of the bullet (in caliber) then multiply by the diameter of the bullet (in inches).  [e.g.  A 50 gr. boattail, length .78 inches, divided by diameter .224, gives us 3.48 length in calibers.  Now divide 150 by 3.48, then multiply by .224 you get 9.65.  You will need at least a 1:9 twist to shoot that bullet.]  I hope this helps.


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