Spike Camp

28 Nosler

28 Nosler
« on: January 20, 2015, 07:27:29 AM »
Is the new 28 Nosler everything that Roy wanted his 7mm Bee to be.
Yes I'm opening up a can of worms. But someone had to do it. ::)
Weatherby seems to be missing the boat and Nosler is giving the Hunting public what they want. What is next from Nosler , maybe a 30 Nosler ?
I think I here some toes being stepped on. ;D
TD

Re: 28 Nosler
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2015, 07:31:19 AM »
I can't speak much on the 28 nosler, but the 26 nosler, Roy has been doing since the mid 40's with the 270 bee.
Will work for Weatherby

fuonlynu

Re: 28 Nosler
« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2015, 07:52:12 AM »
The 26 looks to have not lived up to expectations it does what they claim with light bullets but that's not what shooters wanted, the 28 will be the same way. If you care to search you will find quite a few 26's for sale already . Moslem put out too much hype and promise on this one. Just marketing as a a new 264 would have been enough. Imo

dubyam

  • *****
  • 4925
    • View Profile
Re: 28 Nosler
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2015, 07:54:06 AM »
With 160gr ballistics beyond that of the 7mmRUM, this round is a screamer. The unfortunate cost to that is barrel life may well be 500rds before acurracy falls below MOA. Throat erosion will be severe from just a basic load workup. If a specific rifle is finicky, it's conceivable the barrel could be half to two thirds gone by the end of load work. Practice much at all and you could be changing barrels every 18-24mo.

These Nosler rounds are impressive in claimed velocity, but reality is, much like the RUMs, I suspect they won't be popular nor commercially viable outside of Nosler for very long.
I believe this is a practical world, and in it I can count only on what I can earn.  Therefore I believe in work, hard work. - The Auburn Creed
The older I get, the less stock I place in what men say, and the more I place in what men do. - Andrew Carnegie

eford

  • *****
  • 3598
    • View Profile
Re: 28 Nosler
« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2015, 09:42:31 AM »
26 Nosler, 28 Nosler, and whatever is next from Nosler are only duplication. With a rifle that is not affordable for most hunters, these unbelted magnums are simply the biggest case with the heavy for caliber bullets that have a high BC. Barrel life won't be good. Factory ammo will likely be in short supply. There is nothing about these rifles that appear to me to be "new and improved." For what its worth, I bet 7mm RUM sales aren't close to the popular 7mm Remington Mag.
Of all the gin joints in all the towns in all the world, she walks into mine.

Every man needs to know his limits.

Re: 28 Nosler
« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2015, 10:10:07 AM »
Boy I said I was going to open up a can of worms but really fellows the over priced statement is not quite right. Nosler M48 starts at $1499 and tops out for a full custom at $4999 and the Weatherby MK5 Fiber Mark starts at $1500 and the MK5 tops out at over $5000. Not a whole of difference here if anything the Noslers have more models under $2000 than Weatherby from what I can see from both web site stores. ;D
TD

Re: 28 Nosler
« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2015, 10:11:57 AM »
just another fad like the 7 RUM, 7 WSM, 325WSM, any of the SAUM's and some others. In 4-5 years you will find them at guns shows cheap, and no one wanting to buy them except for donor actions.

Rob

zonie

Re: 28 Nosler
« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2015, 10:12:49 AM »
I think we are missing the point.  Barrel life is not the issue there are a whole bunch of overbore cartridges out there including some  Weaherby  calibers where barrel life is not the greatest.    That's not why guy's buy these ultra velocity calibers and most understand that if it lasts 600 to 1200 rounds they can live with it.  Fortunately these guy's know what they are talking about and what they are getting into,  the unfortunate part is the nimrods that don't know , and get pissed because they wore out a barrel  and start bad mouthing something they are less than educated or experienced in.  It's surely not for everyone, but for those who actually have a need it's a good thing.   Maybe a person ought to learn about something before they make an expensive decision.   I'm actually glad gun companies are pushing the envelope it makes them develop better materials and processes.  

zonie

Re: 28 Nosler
« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2015, 10:26:04 AM »
Catskinner that was not directed at you I was typing that before you posted.   You do have a valid point I think,  guy's let their ego,  macho and keep up with the Jone's  get ahead of their brains.   I have friends that are pushing 4400 fps using a 100 grain 25 cal bullet out of necked down ultra mags their logic is hey we will rebarrel it when it shoots out.  The point being they have a need for this speed and less drop.  They have friends that will just make a new barrel for them so it's not a big deal.    The average person probably doesn't have this luxury and pays for it .     Not every caliber makes it that's just plain true and calibers you would think are today borderline and  a hundred years later  are still going strong.   

dubyam

  • *****
  • 4925
    • View Profile
Re: 28 Nosler
« Reply #9 on: January 20, 2015, 10:37:19 AM »
I'll add some additional thoughts based on comments after mine.  First, the difference between the Nosler and Weatherby rifle offerings MSRPs are that you will pay the Nosler MSRP, as they set pricing and are selling direct.  For a Weatherby, I can buy a new Accumark in any chambering I choose (from the available list, obviously) for about $1600-1800, depending on whether or not I want a 378-based chambering or not.  In some instances, I can source a brand new Accumark for $1500, if I am willing to be patient and shop hard.  A Fibermark is going to run somewhere between $995 and $1150, brand new, from a stocking dealer.

Now, considering the Fibermark most closely compares in terms of features and style to the Patriot, the Nosler rifle is going to run a premium of 50% over the cost of a new Weatherby.  I could buy the Fibermark, slap on a Meopta MeoPro, Zeiss Conquest, or Swaro Z3, and not be far over the cost of the Nosler Patriot rifle in bare form.  Consider then, too, the cost of brass for handloading, and the proposition tilts even more in favor of the Weatherby offering.  Certainly if someone wants to buy the Patriot, I'm not going to stop them, but the old adage about a fool and his money comes to mind in terms of real performance for the dollar.

I tend to agree with your comments, Ron, about pushing the envelope, though in this case, even the long range crowd isn't buying into these rounds lock, stock, and barrel.  I've talked to several guys I know who shoot long range, teach long range shooting, and compete at it, and none of them have much interest in these Nosler rounds, nor the RUMs off which they are based, save the 338cal versions (including factory and wildcat).  The issue is ROI.  The overbore case gives less and less advantage when you shift to smaller bores, and the reality is, the 7mmSTW is not popular because it doesn't offer significant enough advantage over the 7mm-300WinMag to be worth the loss of 1/3 of the barrel life.  And this if for guys who attach their barrels with zippers because of how often they change them.

Again, if someone wants one of these, please go buy one.  But understand going in what you're getting is, first off, not the most powerful or the fastest factory 7mm, as that honor goes to the RUM off which these are based (because the laws of physics apply and case capacity is higher by a marked amount in the RUM versus the shortened Nosler derivative), and you're getting a rifle that is limited use and more a novelty than a utility rifle like one of the Weatherby magnums or a 264WinMag or such.  If you want to spend your money that way, as Ron said, educated prior to the sale, go for it.  I don't see much use in it, and won't be buying one.
I believe this is a practical world, and in it I can count only on what I can earn.  Therefore I believe in work, hard work. - The Auburn Creed
The older I get, the less stock I place in what men say, and the more I place in what men do. - Andrew Carnegie

Re: 28 Nosler
« Reply #10 on: January 20, 2015, 01:05:15 PM »
no worries Ron, it's all cool, I also like that some of these company's are trying to bring out new stuff, and I agree on what you posted, hell that's why I had a 7 RUM, and a 30-378 and 338-378 now.  :)

Rob

FryeBaby

Re: 28 Nosler
« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2015, 03:38:13 PM »
Another thing Nosler gives you is a guarantee of accuracy. They guarantee MOA at 100 yards. I love Weatherby rifles but you spend 2K dollars on a rifle and it won't shoot and they tell you that 1.5 inch group meets their specs. I respect Weatherby as a company and I want a Mark V but if I spend 2K on a rifle a 1.5 group is not acceptable. You get a guarantee with a Vanguard but not a Mark V, I don't get it. I just hope when I get to buy a Mark V with beautiful wood it will not be a 1.5 group rifle.

Chip

  • *****
  • 1843
    • View Profile
Re: 28 Nosler
« Reply #12 on: January 20, 2015, 05:26:13 PM »
Show me an Accumark that doesn't shoot sub MOA and I'll show you a shooter who needs a good coaching session or an eye exam.   Nothing magic about that Nosler Rifle.
Nice to see they make it in Bend Oregon though.   

fuonlynu

Re: 28 Nosler
« Reply #13 on: January 20, 2015, 05:32:20 PM »
I'm getting ready to order or buy a Nosler Patriot in 280 Ackely that will be my Weatherby 264. Sorry I'm slipping over to the dark side.

dubyam

  • *****
  • 4925
    • View Profile
Re: 28 Nosler
« Reply #14 on: January 20, 2015, 05:32:46 PM »
I'm not sure all of it is made in Bend. It may be, but I've also heard unsubstantiated rumor the action comes from none other than the Howa plant in Japan.

As for no guarantee with a Mark V, Chip is spot-on. I've worked with several, and have yet to find one which won't give MOA at 100 and beyond. Most will come a lot closer to half a minute at 100, and 3/4 out beyond 200-300yds. That's well above the abilities of many shooters. If a guarantee matters that much, just buy the RC version of the Mark V. Still in line with the Nosler stuff, pricewise, and has the same paper guarantee.

seriously, buy whatever you want. Just do it educated, like Ron said earlier. And know there is no magic in any of them.
I believe this is a practical world, and in it I can count only on what I can earn.  Therefore I believe in work, hard work. - The Auburn Creed
The older I get, the less stock I place in what men say, and the more I place in what men do. - Andrew Carnegie