Spike Camp

.223 to 5.56 NATO

.223 to 5.56 NATO
« on: May 04, 2015, 05:02:50 PM »
A buddy of mine and I were sitting on his deck this past weekend having a few adult beverages and like always the conversation drifted from hunting, to fishing, to tackle and then to firearms. One of the neighbors stopped by and was all excited about his CZ 527 Carbine in .223 Remington AND 5.56 NATO. He had picked it up used at a local pawn shop. Well, that got me thinking. I thought about the S2 that is chambered in .223 Rem only. I didn't want to say anything but sure enough the guy brought it up. He was looking at an S2 but went with the CZ since 5.56 ammo is about half the price of .223 and it would make a great plinker as well. So, after a few more "adult beverages", we discussed the possibilty of having an S2 rechambered for 5.56. With the No. 2 barrel and the addition of an aftermarket 10 round magazine it would make a great SHTF rifle. And you could always shoot .223's at varmints if you wanted. I know that .223/5.56 bolt guns are as hard to find as hens teeth. They are always "out of stock" or "back ordered". I'm going to check with my gunsmith as soon as I take some aspirin and a little nap. Must be allergies or something?;D
« Last Edit: May 04, 2015, 05:07:27 PM by Downeast »

Chip

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Re: .223 to 5.56 NATO
« Reply #1 on: May 04, 2015, 05:21:35 PM »
223 Wylde should be a pretty easy thing to do on just about any good bolt action rifle.  I know this will bring out the experts but here goes anyway. Personally I wouldn't loose much sleep over firing 5.56 out of a bolt action rifle as long as you stay with 55 grain bullet loads. But that's just me.

danno50

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Re: .223 to 5.56 NATO
« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2015, 05:26:37 PM »
Do you happen to know if the CZ 527 or any rifle that chambers both the 223/ 5.56 Nato are accurate in both calibers out of the same rifle? Sounds like an awesome idea for Weatherby to consider.(1/9 twist or faster)
DosEquisShooter

Re: .223 to 5.56 NATO
« Reply #3 on: May 04, 2015, 05:38:01 PM »
We were thinking something like this...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiWhw2o8g0o

Chip

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Re: .223 to 5.56 NATO
« Reply #4 on: May 04, 2015, 06:32:08 PM »
That big goofy looking magazine just screams tactical.  To my eye it's almost as ugly as my old savage 112 in a Choate stock only it doesn't shoot as well.   

Re: .223 to 5.56 NATO
« Reply #5 on: May 04, 2015, 06:40:31 PM »
Is that ugly in a good or bad way?  ;D

Re: .223 to 5.56 NATO
« Reply #6 on: May 04, 2015, 06:47:07 PM »
And to muddy the waters a little more.

http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/5-56-vs-223/
« Last Edit: May 04, 2015, 07:05:32 PM by Downeast »

Chip

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Re: .223 to 5.56 NATO
« Reply #7 on: May 04, 2015, 06:55:05 PM »
A really ugly rifle will grow on a guy if it shoots tiny little groups.    Not sure how well that set up would work shooting prone.  Most tac gear I ever used was inherently ugly the beauty is in its function.   My Savage isnt tactical but it is ugly.  So maybe it qualifies.

fuonlynu

Re: .223 to 5.56 NATO
« Reply #8 on: May 04, 2015, 07:13:29 PM »
You can have a 223 chambered rifle bumped with a Wylde reamer and set the barrel back just a tad and be good to go.

zonie

Re: .223 to 5.56 NATO
« Reply #9 on: May 05, 2015, 02:10:19 AM »
A buddy a non re-loader has a little stainless  Ruger 77 MKII in 223 in which he used US military and eastern European 5.56 ammo and had primers blow out of the cases into  the hinged floor plate area.   I shot it a few times  and  found a stiff bolt and fired  primers  popped out also in the floor area,  basically it was every one that popped out with this specific eastern euro military ammo.   That same ammo was totally safe in my AR.    I checked the bolt and found the areas around the  bolt   head was starting to deform from over pressure 5.56 cartridges.  A little fileing in non critical areas on the bolt head  had the bolt looking as good as new with the stern warning to my friend not to use new military 5.56 in this particular rifle ever again.  Since then shooting factory 223  no problems.  I tested the gun with 223 and 5.56 hand loads and found the rifle to be extremely accurate, but when loading 5.56 brass and wolf primers ( which I like a lot ).  I found pressures and velocities  to be higher than the same loads loaded with commercial 223 brass.  This was to be expected from previous experience with wolf small rifle primers in this cartridge  that I have used in the past.  The moral to the story is I would not  trust shooting 5.56 in a 223 chamber UNLESS you are a pretty decent re-loader and the knowledge of the different chambers.   A person shooting factory new military stuff might get away with it for the life of the rifle shooting several types of factory  5.56 ammo in a 223 chamber, BUT  then again he might get some very hot military  ammo and get a stuck bolt or damage to the bolt,  so why take a chance.   If you re-load all bets are off you can compensate your loadings to be safe as long as you know what you are doing. 

fuonlynu

Re: .223 to 5.56 NATO
« Reply #10 on: May 05, 2015, 06:32:56 AM »
Years and years ago I shot a couple 5.56's out of one of my T/C Contenders a 14" handgun barrel and all I can say is shit howdy! that thing went off and torqued violently. Even the standard 223 in that configuration was not pleasant to shoot but it was a clover leaf shooting barrel. I sold it to a younger person who thought he just had to have it. I now have a 24" rifle barrel but only use 223 in it. I don't even buy 5.56.

gary d

Re: .223 to 5.56 NATO
« Reply #11 on: May 05, 2015, 09:11:05 PM »
To me this is the non-event of the century.  yes we know that they are externally virtually identical, yes the 5.56 runs at higher pressure, yes the .223 is a tighter chamber thus increasing pressure a bit more.  We also know that Howa chambers the same .223 bbl on an S2 to shoot .308 Win.  The pressures even in the unfavourable match are not likely to exceed those of the latter.  If pressure signs were to appear, well as was pointed out a trip to the gunsmith with a Wylde reamer and problem solved.

Re: .223 to 5.56 NATO
« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2015, 05:00:01 PM »
So, I guess the best thing to do is to purchase a rifle that will fire both. CZ or Ruger. At a little over $300/1,000 rounds that should do for a fun weekend.  ;)


Re: .223 to 5.56 NATO
« Reply #13 on: May 06, 2015, 07:26:21 PM »
If I wanted a 5.56 with a 24 in barrel I would go wth the Stag Arms 6 Super Varminter.Guaranteed to shoot 1/2 in moa.Dont get much better than that.Thinking of one myself even though I sure don't need it.
Roger
Faster horses,younger women,older whiskey,and more money.

silverwolf

Re: .223 to 5.56 NATO
« Reply #14 on: May 06, 2015, 07:35:25 PM »
Get a nice AR-15 platform stamped 5.56 NATO on the barrel/receiver and shoot whatever .223/5.56 ammo you like. Done deal. Good hunting to all