Dano thanks for checking, Remingtons reply was about as I would expect. This begs the question who actually is saami and are they regulated by federal law ? My understanding correct me if I'm wrong companies do not have to be a member of saami. This is where I have some questions do the saami member companies set guidelines and standards for all member cartridges, OR does the member company set the standards for their cartridges and then submit to saami for testing ? I almost bet it's the latter, and I doubt they are regulated by federal laws ?