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Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower

zonie

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Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #15 on: January 02, 2012, 02:20:41 PM »
Sleeper257,   you are not stiring the pot Weatherby needs to be aware of  these things.  It's definately unsat on a WNMR rifle.   I'm not sending it back by any means,  but it should have never went out that way.   By the way mine is not quite that bad,  but it's also black and I'm sure the finish that was applied  filled in part of it.   In either case in the future Weatherby needs to to let Howa know this is not acceptable.  On another older Vanguard synthetic I own there's no grind marks.  Maybe it's a recent thing and a bunch slipped by and no one caught it  ?  

Duby,    I have a different take on the shims,  of all the different bolt actions we own and it's a bunch,   none other than weatherby have shims.  That's not to say other rifles we don't own have shims.   Even if the stocks were cut out of whack slightly on one side,  by adding shims would only make one side or the other  on the floorplate slightly off.   It's more of a pet peive of mine.   I agree on some followers most if not all of your AR15 followers are plastic.  I just don't see it on a  Weatherby bolt action  on any model it's cheesey.   If you have to lube a follower with whatever lube on any type  to stop it from hanging up  it's not right.  

Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #16 on: January 02, 2012, 03:02:18 PM »
I would say that is very bad.I would not have accepted it that way though.
Roger
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Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #17 on: January 02, 2012, 03:07:25 PM »
My sako 85 Hunter 375 H&H cost $1800.00 I would certainly expect the fit and finish to be superior at that price point.
My new Mod 70 featherweight which comes in at the same price point approximately as my 257 Vannie Sporter ( Previous generation ) is very well done, but it too it a $700.00ish rifle and compared to my Sako or MKV you can see the differences.

Heres pictures of them all,you can clearly see the difference price point makes

James
exhale and squeeze

eford

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Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #18 on: January 02, 2012, 04:51:43 PM »
A mid-1990s manufactured Vanguard has a metal follower and it works fine. The S2 Vanguard has a plastic follower and I have not had any problems with it. After reading this thread I looked to be sure what material the follower was made of.

There have been no chips or cracks on the trigger guard of the S2. It's the matte black finish. I think the roughest thing its been in contact with is some prarie grass north of Dodge City. However, I am mindful of the rifle when crossing barbed wire fences, so maybe that's why it is unblemished.

After taking off the stock while cleaning the trigger area I noticed there is a slight difference in the finish below the stock line. I can live with it. It effects nothing. Ed Weatherby said my rifle will shoot less than 1" groups and he's right. The tiny imperfection in the finish doesn't mean diddly to me.

As a very, very small-time firearms dealer I will show anyone my S2 if they want to see it. I like to brag about it since it is a "new" model and where I live there aren't a lot of Weatherby's that I know of, at least not yet.
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Every man needs to know his limits.

Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #19 on: January 02, 2012, 05:27:38 PM »
3 S1's in my safe and 0 S2's.  No scratches in my trigger guards and no plastic parts. I guess I'm no jumping in the pool so fast after all.   
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Chip

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Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #20 on: January 02, 2012, 07:14:13 PM »
The pictures pretty much say it all.  A sad thing to see that kind of workmanship on anything with the Weatherby name on it.  Doesn't matter what the price tag is on the rifle. That's just wrong.

Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #21 on: January 02, 2012, 09:47:11 PM »
This post just made me go to the safe and look at my vannie sporter, a 2009 model. Floor plate is metal, follower is metal.
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Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #22 on: January 03, 2012, 03:40:29 AM »
I couldn't agree with Chip more.  Its a poor representation of a name that has always been all about quality workmanship.  My youngest S1 is 2009.  All metal.  So any word on what Weatherby is going to do about this?
There are as many answers to that one as there are reasons men hunt, fight, skydive, gamble or take up with redheaded ladies.

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Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #23 on: January 03, 2012, 05:06:13 AM »
My S1 .257 Wby mag has a plastic follower,no problems,YET ;D. My Sub moa .338 win mag vanguard has a metal follower.

Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2012, 07:19:32 AM »
It seems that the initial flush over the S2 introduction has been diminished greatly. I guess we are left with a very accurate price point rifle, with some cosmetic problems; as well as the plastic follower.

CZ had a similiar situation a few years ago, when they began shipping with plastic followers. An acquaintance bought one without noticing the weakness. He complained, & was sent a metal replacement. Maybe Weatherby could do the same.

All price point products are heavily compromised in some ways, & then marketed on their good features. Today, almost all rifles give accuracy that was unheard of  a generation ago. But walnut has been replaced with pop bottle plastic, " bottom metal " is now composite, high polish blue is satin, & fit & finish is spotty at best.

If price is a consideration, I guess we all have to decide which features are most important to us, & which downsides we can live with. The problem is that visual defects cause us to be suspicious of overall product value.
                                                                                         Jim

zonie

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Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #25 on: January 03, 2012, 11:05:10 AM »
Jim,  I don't think it could be said any better it makes us suspicious. 

Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #26 on: January 03, 2012, 12:51:53 PM »
I was right on the verge of having my dealer order a new S2 in .270 win, but found out he could get a new S1 for about $60 cheaper. I had him order me the S1 instead, and I'm thinking I made the right choice(from the threads I've read here). Not seen it yet, should be here sometime this week. Hopefully, fit and finish, along with trigger will be excellent. The only fault I've ever had with vanguards was the trigger. Fit and finish otherwise has been excellent.
waterboy452

imr4198

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Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #27 on: January 04, 2012, 10:04:18 AM »
For the members who think that a stainless steel Vannie means the bottom metal is stainless steel.....WRONG.  The Vannie bottom metal is zinc probably.  I hate to scrape off the finish and test it to make sure.  One of the big deals about the plastic follower is cold weather (or very hot weather).  What will this baby do when it freezes up a little after a trip tied to a pack on an Alaskan float plane?  Do you dare punch it down with your thumb to break it loose?  What happens when you leave it in the back of a pickup in the Arizona summer?  Lube in the magazine means lube on the ammo which means lube in the chamber.  Not me, thank you.  It's time for a vote.
imr

petey

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Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #28 on: January 04, 2012, 10:17:59 AM »
Okay, its getting old running to the gun safe to check out the finer points of my rifles.  I definately checked out the trigger guard on my stainless.... looks fine, but the pic above.. oh boy. 
As for my newer Sporter... i'll be darned if it isnt a plastic follower.  That being said, I never paid it much attention as it feeds fine and I've had no issues with it over the year that Ive had it.  But then as IMR said.what about the heat and the cold... not so much just in one season, but years of hot and then cold.... plastic tends to deteriorate with time.  At least with metal you can see the rust and handle it and prevent it.  I also worry about using oils and lubes on plastic that can be destructive to it.
SO... anybody own or work for a manufacturing company?  Seems like there is a market for metal followers with pleany of demand.   ;D

Ed

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Re: Fixing the Plastic Vanguard Follower
« Reply #29 on: January 04, 2012, 10:29:44 AM »
First and foremost I want to thank everyone for their comments and continued support of Weatherby.  I believe most of you know by now I take to heart your comments, regardless of the message. I'm sure you can appreciate the many challenges every company faces in bringing products to market that serve our faithful customers well.  

I can't over-emphasize the value of you're opinions , comments and ideas posted on Weatherby Nation. We truly listen when it comes to making in-line product changes, model redesigns, or when developing new product.  With that said, there is no truer statement than, "You can't please all the people, all the time."  For some, building lighter weight rifles is of paramount importance. Using the current follower (composed of engineered composite resin) helps us to achieve that goal. Others, demand "all steel parts", which makes for a heavier rifle, but they don't care. To many shooters, price is a major deciding point - others tell us, "we'll pay more if <fill in the blank>. "

The examples are endless.  

In this specific case I can tell you the decision to go with an engineered composite resin follower was made and incorporated into our Vanguard line back in 2009. This was, in part, in response to our customers input asking for lighter, stronger, more competitive priced rifles. This feature was carried forward into the newly redesigned Series 2 Vanguard.  Honestly, we're now three years into the change and have received almost no complaints.  However, your recent posts shows us that this issue is something we need to look at more closely.  No company is 100% perfect, 100% of the time, and no doubt there are occasional times a less than perfect product finds its way into the hands of our customers. Over the last several years our Vanguards have been used from the deserts in Africa to the freezing cold of Alaska, with no functional problems.  I will always encourage you to call our outstanding Warranty & Service Department any time you have an issue. Rodney Hill, Warranty Service Supervisor and his excellent team of Teresa Wright and Cheryl Rabener-Helberg will evaluate the issue and do everything they can to insure it is resolved and you are satisfied with your Weatherby firearm.  

In regards to the finish on the barrel, we now are using the same process on the Vanguard as we use on the Mark V and the result is a much nicer looking finish than on the original Vanguard.  I might also add it is more costly to produce but we felt it was worth the cost to provide a higher quality, better looking Series 2 Vanguard.

Again, I take your comments very seriously as we strive to offer products that come as close as possible to making "all the people happy, all the time".  Thanks again for your loyalty to Weatherby and your willingness to post on Weatherby Nation. Customers like you are imperative in making us better.


Ed Weatherby,

Nothing Shoots flatter, hits harder, or is more accurate!