Weatherby Reliability

[Antlers]

I've been considering hunting down a used Weatherby Mark V to use for a big game rifle and have even found a few I've got my eye on. But then I came across this guys long list of grievences and problems he has had with his Mark V over on Optics Talk (which I'll copy and paste for you guys to read) and to be honest it has made me kind of weary of all Mark Vs. So I was wondering, is there any truth to what this guy is saying? Here's what he said:

"a) the super light barrel walks all over as it heats up. You just can't use it for long range shooting (beyond 300 yards) or varmint hunting. 200 yards is my limit on p-dogs and three is the limit for the day.
 
b) least accurate rifle I own. I worked for a year to get it around 1 inch. Shimmed fore end, floated barrel, and tried loads, powder, bullets, primers, seating depth, etc. til I was blue in the face. Now first shot is right on every time, second shot wanders 3/4 inch, third shot wanders 1 inch and after that it starts to wander up to three inches at 100 yards.
 
c) Mark V firing pin design is poor. It screws into the bolt shroud with a ball bearing retainer that just sits on the shroud to prevent the firing pin from turning once installed. It is difficult to remove the bolt shroud without dropping the ball bearing. There is no way to know how far the firing pin protrudes without a micrometer when you assemble it (tough for field repairs/cleaning). The ball bearing is impossible to find in the sagebrush of the prairie, (especially if you are shaking after failing to fire on a giant buck you stalked for two hours). First hunt out from the factory I had six misfires because of insufficient firing pin protrusion (it just kills me to stalk an antelope or deer for half a day and watch them bound away as I fiddle with the rifle and eject loaded rounds on the prairie). Field correction of the problem was even worse. Almost threw it in the lake but have since corrected the problem and learned a lot from Weatherby about firing pin verification.
 
d) Mark V trigger design is poor. After stalking antelope for just three days it got too dusty and failed to engage the sear one out of ten times. I couldn't repair in the field due to lack of solvent and as a result failed with two hard earned antelope shots. I like to carry my chamber empty but with this rifle, you are rolling the dice with a quick chambering when the game appears. Weatherby gave me a cleaning regimen and solvent and now it only fails one out of three hundred chamberings. I believe I could set the trigger above six pounds and rectify the problem but I'm not sure I could detonate a round accurately at that trigger pull weight.
 
e) The bolt has a screw on the rear of the bolt that can come loose too easily and when it does, you are finished hunting. Last year my buddy spent three days hiking in and then stalked a trophy Dall sheep for three days. Somehow, his screw came loose in the hike and when the time came, he discovered that he could not take the shot of his life. Fortunately, his guide had a micro screw driver and they did a field repair but it took him another three days hiking through the mountains to catch up with the sheep.
 
Bottom line:
 
Overall, it is the least accurate and most unreliable rifle I have ever shot; and I have shot a lot of them. Yet I am now thankful that I didn't throw it in a lake on one of my hunts. I feel I have learned to control the design issues and I now limit my use to hunting conditions where a light rifle is nice and shots will be relatively close. I don't see any dangerous game in this rifle's future though.

I know it is not a raving review but it only represents my personal experience. I have have learned to like the rifle enough to keep it but I certainly understand why African PHs grimmace when they see a Mark V."

[fuonlynu]

That's one guy and his problems probably brought on by ignorance. Weatherby mark V rifles high end and worth the money. Optics Talk is highly known for TROLLS, there is always someone there bashing something. The members there are also fanboys of the SS scope line as well as Remington rifles they seem to have to follow each other like puppy dogs rather than go on their own adventures through life.

[nd wbynut]

I have hunted with 2 weatherby mark v rifles for more than 20 years.  My father has hunted with a mark v since the late 1970's.  Although I have yet to shoot an ultra light weight yet (which is going to be my next purchase since I can't find a 375 weatherby mag) we have yet to experience any kind of issues like this guy is reporting.  I have yet to have a fail to fire either on the bench or the field and we reload all our ammunition.  We hunt hard anything from antelope to moose and everything in between.  I have no second thought taking my weatherby out in my home state for deer or taking it on a outfitted hunt in Canada.   I have Remington's and Rugers in my arsenal, I have shot winchesters, savages, and Brownings working up loads for friends and relatives and I never think twice about grabbing my weatherby for hunting. 
As far as the ph in Africa grimacing when a weatherby shows up in camp from what i have always heard it is more about them being push feed actions rather than control round feeding.  I guess i was always of the opinion if you have to load your rifle upside down you already have a bigger problem which could have been solved with proper shooting in the first place.

[D.A.M.]

The guy's username was DakatoMan, right? I've heard him tell that same story on Field and Stream Answers. And why I don't quite agree with his opinion on Mark Vs, I'll say this about him: he is by no means a troll, is EXTREMELY knowledgeable about all things relating to scopes, firearms, and ammunition, and it is wise to take anything he says about those matters into consideration.

[Marshal_]

I'm not the most knowledgeable person around, but my take is as follows:

A - Sounds like he's expecting heavy barrel performance out of a light barrel. I don't care who manufactures your rifle, a light barrel will not, can not, behave like a heavy barrel. There are pros and cons to each, and you need to take that into consideration when you make your purchase. My understanding is that's what light barrels do, heat up quick, wander more when hot, but have the advantage of dissipating heat faster and cutting weight. I could be wrong, but it sounds like that part is functioning as intended. If the first shot is on at 100 yards I can't fathom why it wouldn't perform further out, unless he isn't letting the barrel cool adequately between shots.

B - see A.

C/D/E - These are 2 rifles out of how many thousands? This is the first I've heard of a Mark V with any of those 3 issues. If these rifles were bought used, there's no telling what the previous owner tinkered with or mucked up. Obviously we can't hold Weatherby responsible for that, BUT I have seen folks come on these forums and try to make it sound like a manufacturing issue when it was a previous owner misuse/tinkering issue so it wouldn't surprise me. Without knowing if it was bought secondhand, we can only speculate.

That being said, it's possible that one snuck passed QC slightly misfit causing sear engagement issues and lacking firing pin protrusion. And screws do back out unless they're hit with locktite. Two out of thousands isn't enough to rattle my faith in the brand or the design.

[NWmontucket]

I am behind Marshal, especially when it comes to the barrel consideration. I have never seen a varmint gun that burns a lot of powder that has a thin barrel. Having said that, the guy has done his homework and is sharp and you would do well to consider all he is saying.  And if you do get a mark V get his contact information because he has apparently fixed all that could go wrong with the design.  That being said our family has three mark Vs, none are light models, collectively and between the three rifles there have been thousands of rounds fired in all conditions from plinking on hot summer days to dry dusty or extreme cold conditions in north eastern montana to the icy, slushy, rain and snow drenched mountains of the western half of montana. Never had an issue with hand loads or factory. And all give less than inch groups with more standard taper barrels with the right loads. But like I said before, I do believe the poster with all the problems. Could be that when weatherby made the light models they trimmed ounces where they should not have trimmed ounces. Or maybe he got a lemon. When anything is mass produced there is a possibility of one in the batch not being up to par. I had a remington 870 that was a junker. My buddies all had 870s that would function no matter how much they got beat up. On mine the ejector would lock up, or the firing pin would seize, or the pump would lock up at the bottom of the stroke. So I sold it before I hurled into the river. But I digress, I love my Mark V and you might find one that will never fail you. If you are still unsure keep looking, there are hundreds of rifle/cartridge options available.

[dmhiggz]

Sounds like a guy with an axe to grind.  I'm guessing he found out someone named Weatherby was putting it to his wife.

I have owed probably 20 different Mark Vs, and shot them my whole life, and know tons of other people who have as well, and have NEVER heard of most of the incidents he is describing.  I call BS.  Consider what he is saying regarding the firing pin failures.  If it was truly the case, what kind of an idiot would take that rifle out hunting?  Did he not shoot it beforehand?  If not, again, idiot.  It seems implausible that all of these incidents only happened when he's put on a half day stalk on a trophy animal.

a) Hilarious.  3 shots in a day is his limit?  How in the hell long does he think it takes a barrel to cool down?  200 yards?  I have owned a couple of ultralights and even they are sub MOA out to 600+ yards.  Granted, I don't empty the magazine in a 60 secomd span, but if you have to worry about the accuracy of your 4th shot on a hunting rifle, the rifle isn't the problem.

b) Based on "a", I suspect he just can't shoot.

c) I've never heard of this being an issue.  If you have to do a full strip in the sagebrush, again, you did something wrong.  Test your gear before you go on a hunt.  This is either a complete fabrication, or he's a fool.

d) Mark V triggers are far better than most high production factory triggers.  I've never had a failure and they are easily adjustable.  Are they the best in the world, no, but they are among the best that come in a factory rifle.

e) Another hunting story that is simply hard to buy.  If these rifles are so terrible, why do he and all his friends apparently use them on every hunt?  Most people would have one major failure and go in a different direction, but these guys stick with it, even though they are the worst rifles ever made.  Hilarious.

[griz247]

Last fall I was looking at a new spotting scope. I started researching and became really interested in the redfield rampage. The price was great and I know redfield is made by leupold. I started reading customer reviews and there were dozens and dozens of people raving about this spotting scope. One guy just trashed it and went on and on about what a piece of junk it was. I am glad I didn't go on the advice of that one bad review.

[lamric]

d) Mark V trigger design is poor. After stalking antelope for just three days it got too dusty and failed to engage the sear one out of ten times. I couldn't repair in the field due to lack of solvent and as a result failed with two hard earned antelope shots.

The trigger failed 10% of the time and that cost him 2 antelope, how many shots did he take?

Sorry, but to quote Abraham Lincoln:  "Never believe anything you read on the internet".

[pharmseller]

My Ultra Lightweight in .30-06 is not an accurate rifle.
Great trigger, flawless reliability.
I have rifles that cost half as much that shoot twice as well.


P

[yuma93]

I have been into Weatherbys since 1966. I own quite a few of them and have traveled far and wide with them. Never once have I ever had a problem with the Mark V...a few ammo issues over the years but never a Quality control problem like this fellow states.

I sort of believe in part that he likes to disassemble things when he acquires them.Need I say more... I have known a few of those types over the years.

Ultra lite rigs are not bench rest candidates anyway. As for the Nation I do not see credibility in his claim that warrants our further attention.

[Marishka]

Two targets from my Weatherby MkV in .300 Weatherby Magnum



Two targets from my Weatherby Mk V in .416 Weatherby Magnum

[pharmseller]

Well, sure, anyone could do that from 50 feet.   


P

[25 CAL]

I own an Ultra light Weight Mark V in a 25-05 and yes the barrel heats up quick at the range. It will string shots if time is not allowed for cooling in between shots. It will shoot 1.5 " group at 300yds from the bench. It has its place with me hunting, for a few reasons, it shoots great, its puts em down, and A person carries a rifle hunting more than one shoots it. When im hunting im not after a 5 shot group im after an animal laying on the ground after the first round. As for the other problems mentioned ive never had one with mine.

[D.A.M.]

You asked the same question over at Field and Stream Antlers, and here is what DakotaMan had to say in response to your question and in response to the comments of others on the thread you started:

"Those were my experiences and observations and they came from my first antelope hunt with my new Weatherby Mark V Ultralight. I was excited about using this beautiful new rifle but encountered a few issues with its design on my first hunt. I loved the light weight, the look and feel and most of all the 60 degree bolt throw. Those attributes are top notch. I was also told by numerous people that its ability to fire without blowing up is an important feature too but personally I have had this feature on all my rifles. I've never been blown up by any of them and the Weatherby did NOT blow up either. I just don't get as excited about that feature as some others do because I consider it a constant across all my rifles.
 
I'm sorry to see WAM feels my comments are "BS" but can assure you this factually happened to me. The three Mark V design issues I've been exposed to are not of my making and are part of EVERY Mark V action. You need only look at one to discern for yourself. I don't think of these issues as show stoppers and recognize that I seemed to get hit by multiple problems at once which seems to be quite rare.
 
Although I observed and experienced design issues in my Mark V receiver, that doesn't mean a Weatherby Mark V is useless, and the Weatherby Vanguard has none of these issues. Not many rifles are perfect and each model has its positives and negatives. You just have to be aware of their issues and guard against any risk that they might expose you to. Like any rifle, if you keep them in the safe or walk out back to sit in a tree stand for your hunt, your exposure to risk is much less than if you are hiking miles from home for days at a time in rugged weather.
 
I'd like hear from others to know who factually disagrees with these design observations:
 
FACT #1 - Firing Pin Design. The firing pin screws into the bolt shroud with a small retaining ball that holds it in place. The protrusion of the firing pin from the bolt face is dependent on being on exactly the right firing pin thread as measured by pin protrusion of a few thousandths of an inch. A "short protrusion" of the firing pin is possible causing the bullet primer to dent but not detonate. I've been respectfully told by F&S members that I have no business cleaning or adjusting it. FACTUALLY, (no BS) this is what Weatherby Customer Support advised me to do. NO BS... If you feel this observation is BS, please open it up and LOOK for yourself or at least look at a schematic! Note I am not recommending you open it up because of the risk but if you feel this design is BS go ahead and please look for yourself. Once it is tightened to the appropriate screw thread, it works fine. If it is not adjusted right it fails to fire randomly based on what thread it is ON. If yours fires as expected, leave it alone and don't clean it EVER and it should keep working until it gums up completely. Another alternative is to bring it in to a gunsmith to have it cleaned and hope they know how to do it. If your gunsmith is Weatherby certified (I found one between Atlanta and Montana in Sioux Falls South Dakota), they will know how to do it. Mine came from the factory that way and the very kind and helpful Weatherby Customer Support rep said that it happens occasionally and walked me through the process, recommending extreme caution against losing the retaining ball. I had to wait until I got home from the hunt to do this though because I needed a micrometer and a relatively clean room to catch the BB-sized retaining ball. Please make up your own mind how great a risk losing the retaining ball is for emergency repairs or cleaning. I don't want to mislead anyone... take it out and put it back a few times and see what YOU think. My guess is that this is a rare issue unless you clean your bolt interior or disassemble it for any reason. Then, if you don't know what you are doing, there is a pretty high probability you will mess it up. Just to be completely open, my field failure involved the use of #34 primers because that is all I could get at the time. These are by design the most difficult to detonate with a poor pin strike but I did have failures with other types of primers too since my pin protrusion was measured at only .021.
 
FACT #2. The trigger can and apparently DOES fail to engage the sear (mine is set at a legal 3 pounds as tested with my fish scale) with the combination of factory lubrication and dust. Mine DID FAIL twice in one hunt on two different antelope (NO BS). It got worse as time went on until I had to stop hunting with it. The Weatherby Customer Support rep was most helpful and stepped me through this as well. They offered to repair it for me but of course it would take weeks during hunting season and they felt I could easily do it myself with the correct solvent. I agreed to try it myself and only send it in to them if absolutely necessary. After cleaning with the regimen recommended by Weatherby Customer Support, it fired with only one failure in 300 tries. I've used it that way since. Weatherby advised that if that wasn't satisfactory I could adjust the trigger to more than 4 pounds and move pull weight up until it worked. It's OK with me for now. With the 60 degree bolt throw, I can re-cycle it real fast if needed. If it happens again, I will put an Timney trigger in it. I won't use it for dangerous game. You may not encounter this but I'd heartily suggest that if you intend to hunt in high wind and blowing dirt/sand where you are walking miles daily in rough conditions, bring some alcohol to dip your trigger group in at least nightly. Remove all lubrication, factory or otherwise... NO BS. Make up your own mind on this. It can and DOES happen, NO BS. Note that after about 50 years of such hunts, this was the first rifle I've ever carried that reacted this way to common prairie hunting conditions. I thought the weather was relatively nice but dust WAS blowing almost constantly for three days... NO BS.
 
FACT #3. The little screw might come loose. Take a look behind the bolt handle and see if you observe a little slotted screw (the bolt sleeve lock screw). It should be there... NO BS. You may think that there is NO WAY this little screw can come loose. You are welcome to your own opinion on that. However, I highly recommend that you get a small screw driver and check this little screw as part of your routine maintenance. If you are going to be away from home and hiking miles every day in rough conditions (like some of us hunters do NO BS), I suggest you check it periodically. If you don't believe that this screw being loose will stop your shot, please check it out yourself... loosen this screw and take a shot... see if this is BS. I didn't have this happen to me personally (but I now check mine with regular maintenance) but it happened to my buddy. I know him well enough to believe him without doubt. It happened to him in Alaska and like me, he was quite disappointed when it PREVENTED his trophy Dahl sheep shot of a lifetime. I also believe him when he said his guide saw that he had a Mark V and took a small screw driver just in case it would be needed some time during their hunt. It seemed unfortunate that his guide waited until it failed to discuss it with him rather than checking it periodically. My advising you of this design issue is certainly hearsay but I would suggest you not consider it "BS"... check out your screw or hope for the best... your choice. Several on F&S have stated that their screw has NEVER come loose so I guess that means for them at least, it can't.
 
My accuracy issue is a little different. The lack of accuracy I experienced is an exception for Weatherby rifles. The Ultralight has a very small contour fluted barrel... NO BS... it wanders... NO BS. There is a lump in the forend of the Ultralight to stop it from wandering too far. It is NOT free floated because of this heat distortion issue. Mine shoots like crap... NO BS. That doesn't mean yours will. I talked to a Weatherby Customer Support rep and they said that's the way it is with such a light barrel. The only solution is to put a heavier barrel on it at my cost. I also communicated via email on this issue with someone whose last name was Weatherby. He was sympathetic but concurred. There is NO replacement rifle in the cards for me. I also communicated the three design issues above to him. He didn't seem too happy to hear of these and didn't want to discuss them.

WAM, I realize that since I only shoot accurate rifles, I'm probably one of the few that dusts off my pre-hunt rustiness by shooting lots of prairie dogs way out there before most prairie hunts. I've never had a "short range" or "inaccurate" 25-06 before but could understand that some shooters may be content with that. I don't judge them and hope they don't judge me for choosing accurate firearms, given the choice.
 
I understand that ultralight barrels may have issues but I've shot plenty of light weight 25-06 barrels that were highly accurate. As a matter of fact (no BS) another buddy has the same rifle in .270 Wby and his is very accurate (although yet another buddy has a .257 Wby that shoots like crap too). My only request is that Weatherby make potential customers aware that it could be quite inaccurate and what they get is all they will get. If anyone knows of anyone at Weatherby who will replace my rifle with one that shoots, I'm all ears! My exchange with Mr. Weatherby didn't go that way.
 
WAM, perhaps you misunderstood, I was referring to the Mark V itself in the African hunting comment; not the 25-06 cartridge. Even the .416 Weatherby Magnum has the 3 design issues highlighted in items 1 through 3 above. They are not exclusive to the lighter version of this receiver. You certainly did offer to buy the rifle but since it was a gift I have kept it because of the sentimental value. I would love to have Weatherby replace it but I can live with it. I now understand its limitations and won't be caught by surprise. I can watch for these issues and prepare to maintain my rifle during relatively extreme hunting conditions. I'm still fiddling with the barrel trying to squeeze as much out of it as possible by varying barrel pressure. I'll use the rifle for hunting deer and antelope sized game inside 250 yards and that is not a severe limitation for most of us. I really like the 60 degree bolt throw. Even where I had five consecutive miss-fires (four firing pin and one sear slip) on the same running antelope, I never missed an antelope because of these issues... mainly because of the exceptionally fast re-cycle time. My nephew even commented that he thought he saw four unfired cartridges in the air at the same time on one. NOW that could be BS... I think he was just ribbing me.
 
In closing, let me say to antlers and anyone watching... The Weatherby rifles are a work of art and fine rifles. You will be hard pressed to find a more attractive rifle. Most of them are highly accurate too. The buddy that had the screw problem has nailed lots of game world wide with his 30-378 in the 400 to 700 yards plus range. My comments are not intended to discredit Weatherby rifles; just to make users of those fine rifles aware of a few issues that could catch them off guard at the worst moment. None of us want that to happen and I will openly admit, these failures made my friend and me quite unhappy for a while. I would not want you to have that experience and all it takes is a little preventative maintenance.
 
jhjimbo - I'm a little surprised by your comment to stay the h#ll away from the poor hunter who experienced these issues. That's a little bit like shooting the messenger which seems beneath you. This happened on my first three day antelope hunt with this new rifle of which I was very proud. I was 50 miles out on the prairie 1,500 miles from home. I did have a back up rifle but I persevered with this rifle because of the challenge and because of the friend who gave it to me (it's not nice to look a gift horse in the mouth). I always appreciate your well thought out comments and hope you will forgive me for telling it like I see it; even it if involved a beloved Weatherby. I only put down my OPINIONS and realize others may unceremoniously call them BS. My best to all and good luck with choosing your rifle. I'd buy another Weatherby, but if it is an ultralight I'd get a written guarantee of full replacement if it couldn't maintain 1.5 MOA."